Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

The discussion of the Linus Pauling vitamin C/lysine invention for chronic scurvy

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majkinetor
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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#31  Post by majkinetor » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:39 am

I don't know much about Huggins, but I know a lot about Levy. If you believe Huggins is nothing but the profit laden quack, then you should probably believe so about Levy too, and consequently, not use vitamin C megadoses.

I don't see a point in this discussion to be honest. Who cares if Huggins is a quack or not. I did not base my current knowledge on his opinions (or Levies or Owens) alone. People can be and usually are half wrong half right. I don't see why concentrating on the bad half should be priority.

Also, its more or less normal on this place to ignore big pharma achievements. If you want alternative view, go visit ScienceBasedMedicine.org where you will have standard views discussed, and I can assure you, they don't choose words to diminish role of alternative medicines around, including that of Linus Pauling. Would you go there and say they cherry picked the studies ? Or on Weston Price ? Everybody does that. That is probably the most known problem of science in general. You will have to do your own forum or your own blog if you wish to change that, there is no much point in whining up here or picking up on Owens bad attributes (I was disappointed by several of his actions too, however, that doesn't cloud my mind in such way that I think that all he says is meaningless or that this very place doesn't have a value that is not connected to its owner).

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#32  Post by ofonorow » Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:25 am

M - sorry I have somehow "disappointed you with my actions?" (You mean words?)

"false pretense" assumes something not in evidence. These people willing sought and paid for Huggins services, in the vain effort to overcome terminal cancer. (There is no other explanation reading that case. Obviously the heirs were angry that their parents paid so much for what turned out to be a worthless exercise. Hindsight is great.) I know Huggins believed in what he recommended. I do not believe he was correct in what he recommended. For example, I would have recommended going to Dr. Nicholas Gonzalez.


AG was Terminal what good would it do to yank out her teeth........................Please respond with a direct answer, just a straight answer, not a paragraph depicting how wonderful Huggins is and what he has done for humanity!!!


I would assume the teeth in question had mercury amalgams.

The option was to either a) remove the individual amalgams (repeating myself - a dangerous and expensive process) or b) to remove the entire tooth (with one or more amalgams.)

The "theory" was the the mercury was contributing to the illness, and Huggins had experienced disease remissions after dental revisions.


p.s. In fact he did write a book, entitled UNIFORMED CONSENT. From this book I learned about the case of one child w/diagnosed leukemia - chronic high white blood cell count. All the amalgams were removed, and her WBC dropped to normal. Then the amalgams were put back, and the "leukemia" relapsed. Leukemia is generally considered a form of cancer, so this may have overly influenced Huggins to believe that other cancers might be susceptible to the same treatment. I am not defending his judgment. But one should at least consider that a diagnosis of leukemia may, in fact, not be cancer, rather the body's natural immune reaction to heavy metal toxicity.
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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#33  Post by jknosplr » Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:59 am

O
We beat this horse pretty good, I respect your position , not necessarily agree with it. As the other poster indicate we are not getting much mileage out of this topic that is really helping any one. Every one who has a position, tends to get excessively verbal when trying to make a point. I have no problem with it, as "one who has never cared about any thing, never got upset to begin with" Lets move on to something positive and continue our endeavors.

J

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#34  Post by ofonorow » Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:24 am

Amen
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Ranne

Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#35  Post by Ranne » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:36 pm

In my opinion the link between poor dental health and heart disease exists because both are caused by chronic inflammation, not one causing the other.

Rabbit experiments and theories aside, can anyone point me to one decent study (on people) showing increased heart disease in those who have root canals? compared to those with similarly damaged teeth which have either not been treated, or were treated with alternatives.

I wish those old discussions/debates about root canals had been archived. Because I can't find the clear and present danger of root canal therapy at PubMed; for example these 2 university studies from Germany and Sweden both suggest that losing teeth is a bigger worry than getting root canal therapy in the ones you keep:

This study of 125 heart attack victims says they "exhibited an unfavorable dental state of health. After statistical adjustment for age, gender, and smoking, they exhibited a significantly higher number of missing teeth (P = .001), less teeth with root canal fillings (P = .0015), a higher number of radiologic apical lesions (P = .001), and a higher PSI value (P = .001) compared with individuals without myocardial infarction."

This study found "Only age and tooth loss were significantly associated with CHD... This cross-sectional study did not reveal a significant association between endodontically treated teeth and CHD nor between teeth with periapical disease and CHD."

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#36  Post by Cobraman » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:08 am

As I have posted before there is a correlation, not a cause and effect. I have seen many patients that have "found religion" after long term neglect both dentally and systemically. They get their house in order, start taking care of themselves and there is no evidence health-wise that they were formerly unhealthy. But in the mouth there will be evidence of previous injury, radiographic and clinical evidence of root canals, fillings and crowns.
Ranne wrote:In my opinion the link between poor dental health and heart disease exists because both are caused by chronic inflammation, not one causing the other.

Rabbit experiments and theories aside, can anyone point me to one decent study (on people) showing increased heart disease in those who have root canals? compared to those with similarly damaged teeth which have either not been treated, or were treated with alternatives.

I wish those old discussions/debates about root canals had been archived. Because I can't find the clear and present danger of root canal therapy at PubMed; for example these 2 university studies from Germany and Sweden both suggest that losing teeth is a bigger worry than getting root canal therapy in the ones you keep:

This study of 125 heart attack victims says they "exhibited an unfavorable dental state of health. After statistical adjustment for age, gender, and smoking, they exhibited a significantly higher number of missing teeth (P = .001), less teeth with root canal fillings (P = .0015), a higher number of radiologic apical lesions (P = .001), and a higher PSI value (P = .001) compared with individuals without myocardial infarction."

This study found "Only age and tooth loss were significantly associated with CHD... This cross-sectional study did not reveal a significant association between endodontically treated teeth and CHD nor between teeth with periapical disease and CHD."

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#37  Post by hranch » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:48 pm

I know this is a old topic-but I posted about my root canal tooth having a anaerobic bacteria infection. I have ulcers all around the tooth that will be extracted next week. No antibiotics helped. But what I really chimed in on this topic was about the mercury. While I was seeing a "holistic dentist" they used a instrument to measure the toxicity of my anagrams. Apparently they read at 0.0 to 0.1. My good friend went with me who was fed up with the search for an dentist who know what to do, was watching this instrument. So if I am not leaking any mercury, should I leave this alone and not disturb any other teeth? I read some where that 75% of mercury was released the first couple years of having them.

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#38  Post by ofonorow » Sat Jul 16, 2011 9:40 am

Not to confuse, but when were your amalgams put into your teeth?

There is a magic year (from memory around 1976) and amalgams before then were generally stable. It seems a reformulation of the new amalgams makes them much more dangerous (according to Huggins/Levy in UNINFORMED CONSENT.)
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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#39  Post by skyorbit » Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:54 am

Why do you keep quoting Wikipedia? You know that if a group has an agenda they can edit and skew the heck out of that -- especially for controversial topics like alternative medicine. Like any encyclopedia, if you're doing real research, you use original source material. Didn't you learn that in college? Not encyclopedias and openly biased sites like "quack busters"

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#40  Post by ofonorow » Mon Jul 18, 2011 7:42 am

This question is in reference to?
Why do you keep quoting Wikipedia?


For the reasons you mentioned, I do not even look at their vitamin C and other pages related to alt. med, however, for most scientific topics I find them reasonably reliable. And you know you are getting the conventional view. Why throw out the baby with the bath water? (And if they are wrong, you can quarrel with what they have on their page, lets have at it!)
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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#41  Post by VanCanada » Mon Jul 18, 2011 5:26 pm

ofonorow wrote:Why throw out the baby with the bath water?
Wikipedia is mostly bath water. Throw it out for anything but trivia and non-science related topics.

ofonorow wrote:(And if they are wrong, you can quarrel with what they have on their page, lets have at it!)[/color]
Not always true. Especially with sensitive topics that the establishment has a vested interest in.

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Re: Do I really have to get rid of my root canal-filled teeth?

Post Number:#42  Post by jknosplr » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:49 am

Wikipedia is mostly bath water.
appears that they not only presented a history of the Amalgam filling but also INCLUDED the toxicity controversy. Wonder what their agenda might be.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amalgam_%28dentistry%29

Forget the Amalgam fillings for a moment and lets find a study that looks at the occupational exposure/mortality of Dentists. If all of this is true Dentists should have the highest CVD rate and other internal organ failure in the world. Just for the last 50 years aught to do it, no bath water study's or grassy knoll theory's either!

I can remember when dentists used no masks, gloves ect. Then all of a sudden all this OSHA approved regalia appeared for "my protection", I though I was going to get sick when I sat down in the chair,....... maybe I did..

My mother who lived to 93 went through several iterations of Amalgams according to the bath water report, I hope I can make it to 80!!


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