Paleo Diet

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majkinetor
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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#16  Post by majkinetor » Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:48 am

Niacin, let us know how it works. Dont forget Brazil nuts.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#17  Post by NiacinVC » Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:49 am

majkinetor wrote:Niacin, let us know how it works. Dont forget Brazil nuts.



Will let you know May 1st. Day 1, so far so good
"When one's expectations are reduced to zero, one really appreciates everything one does have"- Steven Hawking

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#18  Post by Horsea » Mon Apr 09, 2012 5:13 pm

All eating regimens sound good - it's not hard to find people who do very well for years on this or that kind of diet. However, what about the rest of us who simply have no desire to eat in these ways and cannot force ourselves to do so.

I recall reading the opinion of nutritionist Ed Bauman where he said that we should eat according to our ethnicity (rather than, I would opine, according to some abstract idea of how people ate 1/2 a million years ago, or how healthy they are in Okinawa). Paleo followers - let's see you after 20 years, okay. Same with the vegans, rawfooders, etc. Our health cannot be all from diet. There's too much other stuff going on. Since the low-carb days of our distant ancestors, we have indeed evolved.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#19  Post by Dolev » Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:02 pm

In my opinion, proper nutrition today must include supplements, no matter how hard we try to eat the right foods. This is not to say that proper food choices aren't of primary importance. They are.
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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#20  Post by majkinetor » Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:16 pm

Horsea wrote:Our health cannot be all from diet. There's too much other stuff going on.

But can be from where exactly then ? Magic ?
Your health is ALMOST ALL from diet, simply, because thats your major input in the body (respiratory system has limited potential in this regard, skin too).

So we already know this (nutrigenomics) what we don't know is what each of us should eat eat exactly and that is related to things you mention - environment, (epi)genetics, metagenetics, infections ...

Like I said, I don't eat according to what people ate million of years ago. I eat like this because science is most convincing for low carbohydrate diet, anthropological data are just one of the evidences for some parts of the theory. There is so much research that its unbelievable in wide array of creatures.

For instance, calorie restriction with optimal nutrition (CRON) is the recognized way of extending life and health span in general animal (I am more interested in later). It can be done by not eating much or at all, or it can be done on low carb, ketogenic diet. I choose later. When you fast, you live on fat (your own fat, hence ketones). When you sleep, you live on ketones (unless you are diabetic, then you degrade your muscles to get sugar - i.e. dawn syndrome).

So, I believe we need to adopt the best we know so far (which might be wrong, but we don't know better). Paleodiet as such is probably on lower scientific end. It just happens its also low carb generally (although it doesn't have to be, just binge on fruit).

And I agree with Dolev - you need both things - good supplementation and good diet. If I had to choose I would choose that my diet influences my supplements rather then vice versa. This is not just the case now, in industrial times, it was the case even in Paleo times (sodium and iodine were typically deficient back then) - Pauling stated in "Orthomolecular psychiatry" that evolution selects for sub optimal levels of micronutrients because cellular machinery is expensive and beyond certain point which is lower then optimal it doesn't make sense to maintain it as benefits are not so big.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#21  Post by sjmusic2 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:28 pm

I agree with everything majkinetor says in his last post...the old saying "You are what you eat" rings very true, albeit with the stated external stresses that we are exposed to on a daily basis.

Regardless of which 'diet' you choose to follow (and there is a BIG difference between a diet and a lifestyle), it really is very simple...how do you feel ? Is your body lean, strong and disease-free. I am on the path to this goal and have made much progress over the past few months. I continue to supplement, but it's worthwhile noting that supplementation alone was not sufficient to yield the same positive results as incorporating what I learned from reading Primal Blueprint and what I continue to read on 'Mark's Daily Apple'. Gary Taubes', "Why we get Fat" is a good primer - it left me with a few questions that PB subsequently answered .

I have been searching (and researching !) for years to try and understand my unique situation...I would eat limited (not restricted) calories and be very active, yet I could not prevent fat from accumulating around my belly. That is until I researched the influence of insulin/glucagon (sugar/refined carbs), PUFA's, grains etc, ie. how what I eat impacts my body. Like I say I still have a ways to go to get to my goal, but I have made significant progress following this lifestyle.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#22  Post by bbtri » Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:48 am

majkinetor wrote:
Horsea wrote:Our health cannot be all from diet. There's too much other stuff going on.

But can be from where exactly then ? Magic ?

Intense physical activity for one. You can give your body all the best nutrition and if you don't use it the way nature intended you're never going to have optimal health. Statistically, a sedentary lifestyle is even worse than smoking for health. Live a sedentary lifestyle and heart disease, cancer, arthritis, hormonal problems, etc are in your future regardless of your diet and supplement regimen. Physical activity is fundamental and no diet or supplement routine will make up for lack of it.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#23  Post by sjmusic2 » Wed Apr 11, 2012 3:50 pm

bbtri wrote:
majkinetor wrote:
Horsea wrote:Our health cannot be all from diet. There's too much other stuff going on.

But can be from where exactly then ? Magic ?

Intense physical activity for one. You can give your body all the best nutrition and if you don't use it the way nature intended you're never going to have optimal health. Statistically, a sedentary lifestyle is even worse than smoking for health. Live a sedentary lifestyle and heart disease, cancer, arthritis, hormonal problems, etc are in your future regardless of your diet and supplement regimen. Physical activity is fundamental and no diet or supplement routine will make up for lack of it.

Wow, that's a pretty categoric statement...and one I don't particularly agree with. There are many people that live a sedentary lifestyle that do not suffer from any of the diseases that you stated. I think that you'll also find that the average person is active enough to benefit from superior nutrition. You can also find many instances of non-SAD communities around the world who are very active, yet suffer from some of the diseases you referred to. You may want to read some of the work done by Weston Price, Gary Taubes and Mark Sisson to name a few. Insulin is one of the keys and grain and PUFA toxicity are others.

I do believe that the correct approach to physical activity is fundemental to the highest quality of life, especially as we age, but it is not essential, unlike good nutrition.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#24  Post by majkinetor » Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:28 pm

bbitri wrote:Intense physical activity for one

This is almost completely untrue, and even opposite: chronic intense physical activity is detrimental to health (there is wide array of problems professional sportsman have, including those that are not in the team sports) - discus hernia, heart disease (marathon), arthritis, problems due to chronic injuries of same spots, eating disorders (ballet) etc...

Furthermore, chronic exercise leads to diminished nutrient status. This is the reason why "common cold and vitamin C" topic is closed for this category of people and deemed as highly beneficial (even in Hemilla meta analyses). Magnesium deficiency is common as you loose a lot via sweat.

Personally, the only time when I was sick during last 3 years was when I was exercising every day (with bunch of supplements and awesome diet even).

HIIT style exercise, not too much (like 20 minutes 2-3 times per week) seems to be all you need for good health. Completely sedentary style is definitely not good.

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Re: Paleo Diet

Post Number:#25  Post by studentroland » Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:03 pm

The "Eocene diet" was new to me...:) ...but provided an interesting window-view into the emergence of fruits and human evolution...and that fruits on the whole came into existence at around the same time as primate ancestors lost the GULO-enzyme, around 63 million years ago?...although most of the fossils of fruit don´t show up until 30 million years later during "Oligocene"?...
http://www.thegreatstory.org/timeline2.html
Anyway, very many human characteristics seems to have originated quite late, evolutionary speaking, around 7-5 million years ago, according to the Aquatic Ape Theory, see this link:
http://www.primitivism.com/aquatic-ape.htm
and a conference about this theme will be held in London in May...however, it doesn´t include any reference to vitamin C-deficiency...
http://www.royalmarsden.nhs.uk/SiteCollectionDocuments/education-conference-centre/events/2013-evolution.pdf


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