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 Homemade Lypo C 
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Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
The following homemade recipe for Liposomal Vitamin C was circulated on another forum I belong to. I haven't had a chance to try it yet so it may not work.

Quote:
Subject: CS>Liposomal Encapsulation Technology: Vit "C"

In our recent researches evaluating this technology and, consequently, in searching for possible "process" improvements/modifications which might facilitate the "lay person" an opportunity for a DIY methodology achievable in a home environment---we did achieve some notable progress.

First, a brief summary of our exploratory activity. Our literature searches revealed several companies actively exhibiting valid capability in this area (LET).

Typical, and demonstrably capable, is a company named MICROTEK. Microteklabs.com
Helpful information is available here.

One fact became obvious, early on, to wit: The truly striking feature of LET was a NATURALLY-occurring characteristic...... and not a man-made process, that was driving this encapsulation process. That is, this process is a function of an automatic, "natural tendency" of certain substances (e.g. phospholipids in this case) to form tiny vacoules or
bubbles---called liposomes----when in a aqueous solution under certain conditions. "

The keystone activity is that these liposomes automatically fill themselves with whatever aqueous solution they were in----before they were formed. "This type of bubble, called a membrane, forms a protective barrier around virtually every cell in the human body."

Livon Labs has perfected a process which employs a high-pressure (1700 p.s.i.) discharge system which directs a liquid stream against a forming plate. The high impact forces the phospholipids (soy lecithin in this case) to form liposomes----so small they require an electrom microscope for viewing. This technology does not create the LET activity....it just enhances it.

In our personal researches we have determined the key to exploiting the LET phenomenon appeared to be Livon's application of intense force in their mixing methodology.

Enter the "enlightening" moment. Searching for a method of achieving liposomal encapsulation, it occurred to us to explore ultrasonic stimulation as an option. It worked...maybe not quite as well as Livon's "high tech" brute force approach...but about 70% as well. Plenty efficient for our purposes.

Our vitamin "C" liposomal encapsulation protocol is as follows:

Using a small (2 cup) Ultrasonic cleaner, (Item #03305, obtainable from Harbor Freight @ about $30.00), we performed the following:

1. Dissolved 3 level tablespoons of soy lecithin in 1 cup of water (preferably distilled).

2. Dissolved 1 level tablespoon of ascorbic acid powder (Vit. "C") in 1/2 cup
of water.

3. Poured both solutions together in the ultrasonic cleaner bowl and turned the unit on. Using a plastic straw (leaving the top of the cleaner opened), gently, slowly, stirred the contents.

Note: The cleaner will, automatically, self-stop about every 2 minutes. Just push ON button to continue. Repeat for a total of 3 series (6 minutes). By that time the entire solution should be blended into a cloudy, homogeneous, milk-like mixture. The LET solution is now formed.

4. This protocol furnishes about 12 grams (12000mg.) of vitamin C product. At 70% encapsulation efficiency, 8400 mg would be of the LET type. This solution will keep, acceptably, at room temperature for 3 to 4 days. Refrigerated, it will keep much longer. We use it so fast around our place...there isn't enough left to be concerned over storage. The "homogenizing effect" is so powerful that after 3 days at room temperature, no precipitation or solution separation appears evident. This type of sequestered vitamin "C" has demonstrated to be, at least 5 times more effective (per volumetric measure) than any other form of orally-ingested vitamin "c"....that we have tested. Additionally, it appears to be even more rapid in tissue-bed availability----than IV applications. An astounding revelation....to us. We estimate the DIY researcher can produce the active LET portion of this solution for 15 cents per gram....as against about $1.00 per gram from commerci! al sources.

It is my hope that this, limited, explanation of our activities in this area,
is of some value to our do-it-yourself health-maintenance researchers. In any event, this protocol has demonstrated to be n on-toxic and most helpful to OUR RESEARCHES.
Sincerely, Brooks Bradley.

p.s. A larger, more powerful, ultrasonic cleaner is now available at Harbor Freight. Item number 91593. 2+ liters, for about $60.00. Both units have performed quite well for us. Almost as well as our $500.00 lead zirconate titanate, research grade, unit.


Good Luck & Good Health,

Del :-)


Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:12 pm
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
The following homemade Liposomal C recipe received on another forum I belong to. Haven't had time to try it yet to see if it actually works. - Del

Quote:
From: Brooks Bradley
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 12:20 PM
To:
Subject: CS>Liposomal Encapsulation Technology: Vit "C"

In our recent researches evaluating this technology and, consequently, in searching for possible "process" improvements/modifications which might facilitate the "lay person" an opportunity for a DIY methodology achievable in a home environment---we did achieve some notable progress.

First, a brief summary of our exploratory activity. Our literature searches revealed several companies actively exhibiting valid capability in this area (LET).

Typical, and demonstrably capable, is a company named MICROTEK. Microteklabs.com
Helpful information is available here.

One fact became obvious, early on, to wit: The truly striking feature of LET was a NATURALLY-occurring characteristic...... and not a man-made process, that was driving this encapsulation process. That is, this process is a function of an automatic, "natural tendency" of certain substances (e.g. phospholipids in this case) to form tiny vacoules or
bubbles---called liposomes----when in a aqueous solution under certain conditions. "

The keystone activity is that these liposomes automatically fill themselves with whatever aqueous solution they were in----before they were formed. "This type of bubble, called a membrane, forms a protective barrier around virtually every cell in the human body."

Livon Labs has perfected a process which employs a high-pressure (1700 p.s.i.) discharge system which directs a liquid stream against a forming plate. The high impact forces the phospholipids (soy lecithin in this case) to form liposomes----so small they require an electrom microscope for viewing. This technology does not create the LET activity....it just enhances it. In our personal researches we have determined the key to exploiting the LET phenomenon appeared to be Livon's application of intense force in their mixing methodology.

Enter the "enlightening" moment. Searching for a method of achieving liposomal encapsulation, it occurred to us to explore ultrasonic stimulation as an option. It worked...maybe not quite as well as Livon's "high tech" brute force approach...but about 70% as well. Plenty efficient for our purposes.

Our vitamin "C" liposomal encapsulation protocol is as follows:

Using a small (2 cup) Ultrasonic cleaner, (Item #03305, obtainable from Harbor Freight @ about $30.00), we performed the following:

1. Dissolved 3 level tablespoons of soy lecithin in 1 cup of water (preferably distilled).

2. Dissolved 1 level tablespoon of ascorbic acid powder (Vit. "C") in 1/2 cup
of water.

3. Poured both solutions together in the ultrasonic cleaner bowl and turned the unit on. Using a plastic straw (leaving the top of the cleaner opened), gently, slowly, stirred the contents. Note: The cleaner will, automatically, self-stop about every 2 minutes. Just push ON button to continue. Repeat for a total of 3 series (6 minutes). By that time the entire solution should be blended into a cloudy, homogeneous, milk-like mixture. The LET solution is now formed.

4. This protocol furnishes about 12 grams (12000mg.) of vitamin C product. At 70% encapsulation efficiency, 8400 mg would be of the LET type. This solution will keep, acceptably, at room temperature for 3 to 4 days. Refrigerated, it will keep much longer. We use it so fast around our place...there isn't enough left to be concerned over storage.

The "homogenizing effect" is so powerful that after 3 days at room temperature, no precipitation or solution separation appears evident. This type of sequestered vitamin "C" has demonstrated to be, at least 5 times more effective (per volumetric measure) than any other form of orally-ingested vitamin "c"....that we have tested. Additionally, it appears to be even more rapid in tissue-bed availability----than IV applications. An astounding revelation....to us.

We estimate the DIY researcher can produce the active LET portion of this solution for 15 cents per gram....as against about $1.00 per gram from commerci! al sources.

It is my hope that this, limited, explanation of our activities in this area,
is of some value to our do-it-yourself health-maintenance researchers. In any event, this protocol has demonstrated to be n on-toxic and most helpful to OUR RESEARCHES.

Sincerely, Brooks Bradley.

p.s. A larger, more powerful, ultrasonic cleaner is now available at Harbor Freight. Item number 91593. 2+ liters, for about $60.00. Both units have performed quite well for us. Almost as well as our $500.00 lead zirconate titanate, research grade, unit.


Good Luck & Good Health,

Del :-)


Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:27 pm
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:42 am
Posts: 20
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Since I belong to several groups, some things get cross-posted. I'm on a breast cancer forum in which many things are shared about our protocols, especially vitamin C. I thought of your post about making your own, when I came across this. I have left all names out because this is cross-posting and I respect privacy. Thought it would really be of interest here. Deva


*******
"In our recent researches evaluating this technology and, consequently, in searching for possible "process" improvements/ modifications which might facilitate the "lay person" an opportunity for a DIY methodology achievable in a home environment- --we did achieve some notable progress.
First, a brief summary of our exploratory activity. Our literature searches revealed several companies actively exhibiting valid capability in this area (LET).
Typical, and demonstrably capable, is a company named MICROTEK. Microteklabs. com
Helpful information is available here.
One fact became obvious, early on, to wit: The truly striking feature of LET was a NATURALLY-occurring characteristic. ..... and not a man-made process, that was driving this encapsulation process. That is, this process is a function of an automatic, "natural tendency" of certain substances (e.g. phospholipids in this case) to form tiny vacoules or
bubbles---called liposomes--- -when in a aqueous solution under certain conditions. "
The keystone activity is that these liposomes automatically fill themselves with whatever aqueous solution they were in----before they were formed. "This type of bubble, called a membrane, forms a protective barrier around virtually every cell in the human body."
Livon Labs has perfected a process which employs a high-pressure (1700 p.s.i.) discharge system which directs a liquid stream against a forming plate. The high impact forces the phospholipids (soy lecithin in this case) to form liposomes--- -so small they require an electrom microscope for viewing. This technology does not create the LET activity.... it just enhances it. In our personal researches we have determined the key to exploiting the LET phenomenon appeared to be Livon's application of intense force in their mixing methodology.
Enter the "enlightening" moment. Searching for a method of achieving liposomal encapsulation, it occurred to us to explore ultrasonic stimulation as an option. It worked...maybe not quite as well as Livon's "high tech" brute force approach...but about 70% as well. Plenty efficient for our purposes.
Our vitamin "C" liposomal encapsulation protocol is as follows:
Using a small (2 cup) Ultrasonic cleaner, (Item #03305, obtainable from Harbor Freight @ about $30.00), we performed the following:
1. Dissolved 3 level tablespoons of soy lecithin in 1 cup of water (preferably distilled).
2. Dissolved 1 level tablespoon of ascorbic acid powder (Vit. "C") in 1/2 cup
of water.
3. Poured both solutions together in the ultrasonic cleaner bowl and turned the unit on. Using a plastic straw (leaving the top of the cleaner opened), gently, slowly, stirred the contents. Note: The cleaner will, automatically, self-stop about every 2 minutes. Just push ON button to continue. Repeat for a total of 3 series (6 minutes). By that time the entire solution should be blended into a cloudy, homogeneous,
milk-like mixture. The LET solution is now formed.
4. This protocol furnishes about 12 grams (12000mg.) of vitamin C product. At 70% encapsulation efficiency, 8400 mg would be of the LET type. This solution will keep, acceptably, at room temperature for 3 to 4 days. Refrigerated, it will keep much longer. We use it so fast around our place...there isn't enough left to be concerned over storage. The "homogenizing effect" is so powerful that after 3 days at room temperature, no precipitation or solution separation appears evident. This type of sequestered vitamin "C" has demonstrated to be, at least 5 times more effective (per volumetric measure) than any other form of orally-ingested vitamin "c"....that we have tested. Additionally, it appears to be even more rapid in tissue-bed availability- ---than IV applications. An astounding revelation.. ..to us. We estimate the DIY researcher can produce the active LET portion of this solution for 15 cents per gram....as against about $1.00 per gram from commerci! al sources.
It is my hope that this, limited, explanation of our activities in this area,
is of some value to our do-it-yourself health-maintenance researchers. In any event, this protocol has demonstrated to be n on-toxic and most helpful to OUR RESEARCHES.
Sincerely, ...
p.s. A larger, more powerful, ultrasonic cleaner is now available at Harbor Freight. Item number 91593. 2+ liters, for about $60.00. Both units have performed quite well for us. Almost as well as our $500.00 lead zirconate titanate, research grade, unit."





********************************************************************************************

Pamojja,

I think the reason you can't find it is because they don't market it as Liposomal product. It turns out to be Lecithin, which has the components of Phosphatidyl. This is what arranges itself to make the bubbles that encapsulate the product. The bubbles are what are called liposomes, so that's why you won't find it under that name.

Joiv,

I agree, I think you would expect higher tissue concentrations with higher blood concentrations, assuming that the C was traveling into the tissue. As an analogy, a diabetic with high blood sugar levels has lots of glucose in the blood, but the problem is the cells are not allowing it to enter. It could be because they are saturated, or it could be because they are resistant. But that brings us to the basic question, is the C concentration in the blood higher because the cells are full or is it because the cells are not accepting the C.

Owen,

Yes, that's where I was getting confused. I haven't seen the graphs, but I still find it hard to fathom that one gram of lypo C can boost plasma C levels to that of a 25 gram IV. Mathematically, it doesn't make sense. Unless the liver is converting glucose to C based on the intake of the lypo C. But that seems very far fetched to me. At any rate, I am going to blindly assume that the what Levy has said is true and that Lypo C is superior to IV C and have faith in what you are saying with regards to Hicky/Saul and that Lypo C concentrations when ingested orally are indeed as high as IV C. So, then...on with discussion (or mini-novel, however you want to see it.)

Well, I went out and bought the ultrasonic cleaner yesterday

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/D ... mber=95563

It was about $64 with tax. Then I went and bought some liquid Lecithin at the local health food store, for about $6, this is what I bought.

http://www.nowfoods.com/Products/Produc ... 003823.htm

The product label says it is 15% Phosphatidyl Choline, which is the predominant form of phosphatidyl in the product.

The Liveon website states "LivOn Labs adds a mixture of "essential phospholipids" - predominately phosphatidylcholine - to pharmaceutical-quality ascorbic acid."

http://www.livonlabs.com/cgi-bin/htmlos ... 4017925865

Is this the same base material? I don't know nor would I have any idea of finding out short of calling Liveon and asking, but I somehow assume they wouldn't tell me.

Anyway, on to the experiment.....

A few years ago a friend of mine gave me for my birthday a drink mixing set for making adult beverages...It was a science themed set and came with test tubes, a test tube rack and a glass stir rod. I finally got use it today!

I first started with filling the Ultrasonic Cleaner (UC) half way with water. I then put about a half teaspoon of pure AA into a test tube and then added a little more than double that volume in distilled water. I proceeded to mix and mix and mix with the little glass stir rod to dissolve the AA as completely as possible, but wasn't making a whole lot of progress. I then decided to see what would happen if I put the test tube in the UC. Wouldn't you know it, the sound waves proceeded to dissolve the AA crystals into the water. 30 seconds later, the water was totally clear!

So, it appears that UC waves will, at the very least, dissolve AA into water which I believe indicates that it will perform a rudimentary type of mixing which is more efficient than actually physically stirring.

Phase 2, add the liquid lecithin (LL). This stuff is thick, it's about the consistency of honey, but a little darker and very sticky. At first, I added about an equal amount of the LL to the test tube with the dissolved AA. It stayed very much separated from the water and was just floating on top with no signs of emulsification. The next thing I did was place the test tube in the UC. I watched and started to see a white cloud come off the LL and flow into the water. I let it sit for about 2 minutes and the cloud grew some, but the LL and the water were still basically two separate items.

Step number next. I began to stir the the ingredients with the stir rod while holding it in the UC bath. The ingredients began to mix and at the very least the LL began to emulsify into the water. However, after about 3 or 4 minutes, the best I could get was a mixture that was very clumpy with LL globs and a liquid portion was somewhat orangy yellow.

It seemed there was not enough liquid water in the mixture since it was remaining very thick. In a second test tube, I made another batch of AA with distilled water, again with about a half teaspoon of AA, placing it in the UC until the AA was completely dissolved. I added this to the first test tube which then gave me a test tube that was about 2/3 full by volume. I then proceeded to place this in the UC and mix. the mixture became much more liquid and the LL clumps began to dissolve very nicely (though not totally). I thought that it may be to much mixture for the amount of energy being put out by the UC and moved some of the liquid back to the second test tube.

The second test tube was now about 1/3 full and I placed this in the UC and began to stir. It did continue to make a more uniform liquid, though there were still some small clumps of LL. My rough estimation is that the current mixture is 2 parts AA dissolved in water to 1 part LL. I may try 3 parts AA in water to 1 part LL later.

The result is that the mixture, while being stirred and in the UC bath became a medium orange/yellow color. I have since set aside the test tubes and covered them to keep the contents from oxidizing. I observed that there seemed to be a slight separation of a light yellow less dense looking liquid that settled to the bottom and a slightly darker yellow orange thicker liquid moving to the top. I am going to let it sit for a few hours to see if there is more separation.

Here is the question...was liposomal encapsulated AA created or was the LL emulsified into the water? The problem is I don't have a way to test this. The only think that comes to mind right now is that when tasting the product, it should taste a lot less acidic than would be expected of regular AA. Of course, diluting AA in oil, I would expect it to taste less acidic. The only other option would be a blood test to see what the AA plasma level would be drinking the mix vs drinking AA in water. I don't know who would perform this or how much it would cost.

I'll write back later to let everyone know if the liquid separated out or not or remained somewhat homogenized.

James

EDIT: Maybe as another way to test the encapsulation, create a large batch, take about 10 grams at one time, and see if there is any GI distress. If the AA is in fact encapsulated, there should be no GI distress, right? Unless LL in a large portion will cause it. comments?

p.s. If I could post pictures, I would. Otherwise, maybe later, I'll try to video the process and post it on youtube.[/quote]


Wed Aug 12, 2009 4:45 am
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Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Deva

Thanks so much for that post. It had some good information and it seems that they had good results with the smaller unit. If I were them, I would take apart the front panel of the small unit and just solder the on switch to keep from having to press it all the time...lol.

I see two things that they did differently that may have proved helpful. One, it seems that the liquid was poured directly into the cleaner. I had considered this, but wasn't sure if the stainless steal would have some negative effects on the AA or if I might accidentally encapsulate some nickel or other metals that I would later be ingesting. I don't think it would hurt doing it a few times, but maybe over a longer period of time, it could be a problem.

The second thing was that they didn't mention the lecithin as being the liquid form, which is very sticky and difficult to work with. If they used the dried granular form, maybe that's why there were having a greater success. I'll get some granular form today to try out to see if it makes a difference.

I will relate my most recent attempt at the homemade lypo c. The attempt was to heat the liquid lecithin to see if it would dissolve more easily in water. I placed a little in a measuring cup of stainless steel and heated it on the stove until it was a little more liquid. It basically coated the bottom of the measuring cup. I had already prepared a tablespoon of AA in 2/3 cup of water. After the lecithin was heated, I placed it in the ultrasonic cleaner and poured the water in. It produced the same white cloud, but must have been been more efficient because it had a bit more yellowish tint to it, so I assume that more of the lecithin was dissolved into the water.

After a few minutes of stirring, I transfered it to a glass cup to observe. As a final test, I downed the whole thing, 12 grams worth of AA. If there was encapsulation, there should be less GI effect. Well, the result was that there was very little GI disturbance. 12 grams should have cause a bowel tolerance reaction, but there was none.

Del, do you happen to know how the authors of the other post came about with the figure of 70% encapsulation? That seems remarkable, but seeing as how they have professional equipment, maybe they have their own lab and can determine efficiency and whether or not there was encapsulation and not just disbursement of the lecithin in the water.

I'm going to try some more experiments today, especially with the granulated lecithin. Maybe I'll line the ultrasonic cleaner with saran wrap to provide a barrier between the water and stainless steel while allowing for the maximum power to effect the mixture. Again, I'll report back with observations.

james


Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:01 am
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Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Hi James,

Thanks for your work in this. I and others are very interested.

Quote:
Del, do you happen to know how the authors of the other post came about with the figure of 70% encapsulation? That seems remarkable, but seeing as how they have professional equipment, maybe they have their own lab and can determine efficiency and whether or not there was encapsulation and not just disbursement of the lecithin in the water.


I'll backtrack the post on the other forum and see if we can get an answer as to how 70% encapsulation was determined.

Appreciate,

Del


Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:24 am
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Posts: 253
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Del wrote:
Hi James,

Thanks for your work in this. I and others are very interested.

Can only second this.

ofonorow wrote:
.. I know from conversations with LivonLabs, that, at least in the past, the source of phospholipids that are appropriate was limited - at that time, only 2 companies, and one was in Germany.

pamojja wrote:
jaamzg wrote:
To purchase some liquid phospholipids at the local health store, ...

... seems not that easy. Asked in a few pharmacies, and no one would have liposomes to sell, so far.

jaamzg wrote:
Pamojja,

I think the reason you can't find it is because they don't market it as Liposomal product. It turns out to be Lecithin, which has the components of Phosphatidyl. This is what arranges itself to make the bubbles that encapsulate the product. The bubbles are what are called liposomes, so that's why you won't find it under that name.


Actually I did ask for phospholipids - sorry for mixing these terms in my post. Wouldn't have thought ordinary lecithine with a mere 15% phospholipids content would already suffice, especially Oven's comment made me think that only certain phosphlipids would be appropriate.

Owen, do you recal any of the specifics? Guess there could there be a difference if concentrated phospholipis instead of lecitine would be used?


Last edited by pamojja on Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Thu Aug 13, 2009 12:22 pm
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Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Del wrote:
I'll backtrack the post on the other forum and see if we can get an answer as to how 70% encapsulation was determined.
Del

Del, do you have a link to the original thread that you could post ?


Deva wrote:
Here is the question...was liposomal encapsulated AA created or was the LL emulsified into the water? The problem is I don't have a way to test this. The only think that comes to mind right now is that when tasting the product, it should taste a lot less acidic than would be expected of regular AA.

Would it be valid to measure pH before and after ?


Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:31 pm
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Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Hi Owen,

The original post was on the Colloidal Silver List. I have posted a question to Brook there but not received a response yet. I understand Brook is a scientist that's well versed in this type of thing but I'm going on hearsay. You can join the Silver group and pose a question to Brook yourself at:

http://silverlist.org

I know a number of people are working on this "homemade" Liposomal Vitamin C so would expect the effort to pay off.

Good Luck & Good Health,

Del


Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:06 am
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Follow-up from yesterday.

I did not get a response on the question to Brooks but there was a posting by another member of the Silver group that pretains to this string.

Quote:
Hello Everyone...

Today I bought everything I needed to make my Liposomal Vit-C. My ultrasonic cleaner was on sale so that was a plus...$24.95. I put everything together just like Brooks said and it all turned out the way he said would...so I took my first dose...the taste was not bad at all. I also bought some d-ribose powder and plan to make that into a liposomal concoction. I cannot wait to feel the results.


Best regards...

Sandy


Planning to make some myself soon as my non GMO lecithin crystals arrive. I'll report back as well.

Del


Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:15 pm
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Several more pieces of follow-up discussion on the Silver list involving homemade Liposomal Vitamin C.
Quote:
Hi all...

After my first batch of LC sat in the fridge over night it separated...wondering if anyone could explain why or what I might have done wrong? Brooks said it would not separate....hum?


Best regards...

Sandy


Quote:
Dear Sandy,

My apologies; I neglected to outline the attendant, probable, variations in the
protocol. What I SHOULD have said in my original post is "The visible, obviously
homogenized, portion of the solution", whenever I made the comment about the stability of the completed, resultant, material.

I believe you will gain a little better knowledge of the results you achieved, after reading my most recent comment on an inquiry by Sheila.

Bottom line----your result was perfectly normal. Interestingly, the meniscus may present at the top...or the bottom.....or not at all. Usually if the initial material combination
has not run long enough to incorporate a majority of the lecithin (or there is simply too much lecithin for the available ascorbic acid fraction.....the meniscus will form on the top of the sample....within a few minutes after stopping the US agitation.

If your procedure has run acceptably well and----long enough to homogenize well, any meniscus formation will, generally, present on the BOTTOM after overnight storage---
with or without refrigeration.

In any event, you are doing fine. If you do not want to consume the isolated lecithin fraction you are observing, just decant the homogenized liposome solution and
dispose of the isolated lecithin fraction.

I hope this information helps your dilema.

Sincerely, Brooks Bradley.

p.s. One just needs to continue to experiment "around-the-edges" of this protocol, in order to achieve optimum results. Do not be reluctant to do such...this IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE....just common sense.


Quote:
Dear Sheila,

Your question has been asked by others....(private inquires addressed directly to me). In the interest of saving me time and energy, I offer the following explanation. First, soy lecithin is a "slow" incorporator, when introduced into aqueous mediums....sometimes. Especially, when there is a high

lecithin granule population ratio----relative to the total water volume. The general reaction is that a major percentage of the lecithin blends readily with the the water medium, but there will remain a definitive lecithin component which floats on the surface and exhibits a somewhat "gelatinous" appearance (this is quite natural, based upon the native characteristics of the substances involved). Do not fret over encountering such circumstances......they will not compromise the basic effectiveness of your protocol. However, it is of some import to understand that the speed, and completeness, of the incorporation of the granular lecithin---into the aqueous medium, is affected by a number of conditions such as the total amount of lecithin versus the total volume of water; the temperature of the water-based solution and the strength of any other substance being incorporated into the parent solution----from very weak, to saturated (none of which are seriously comprom! ising).

Under the best of conditions, even after ultrasonic mixing for 8 to 9 minutes....there is, often, a thin meniscus (a distinct separation between two or more liquids in the same container). [Example: a thin layer of oil lying on top of water.] In the liposome generation methodology we are discussing, the visible, gelatinous, portion of the meniscus is principally made up of unincorporated lecithin. Is IS NOT a problem....in fact the lecithin component has useful, cardiovascular, health-support effects----beyond those being discussed here.

Either (or both) of two measures may be executed to reduce the volume of unincorporated lecithin you may be encountering. First, increasing the volume of the total water fraction, or secondly, raising the temperature of the total parent solution and extending the time of US reaction exposure. One reason for the condition you are encountering is that the closer one gets to achieving a saturated solution of lecithin....the more resistant the process becomes to accepting more granular lecithin into that solution-----until the point is reached where no further material will incorporate---hence, THE SATURATION POINT IS EXPERIENCED.

In my brief, original post, I did not discuss the nuances of speed, degree or completeness of dissolution of the lecithin----or for that matter--- the ascorbic acid fraction. Neither did I outline a number of other considerations; such as the effects of varying the volume of water versus the ratios of the solution components....or the total water volume versus the protocol components....primarily, because such elaborations would not serve usefulness/effectivity for the nontechnical

DIY person. I simply outlined a SAFE, mid-spectrum, protocol allowing the average lay-person to achieve a measure of acceptable results for home experimental research.

My personal bias is that it is better to have a small, uncombined, lecithin fraction presenting as a meniscus.....than to strive toward what I perceive to be a cosmetic achievement----of small consequence.....by means of diluting the total solution. In any event the excess lecithin is a positive addition.....it is just not active in the liposome process-----until some parameter changes that avails it the opportunity participate in the encapsulation process.

My final comment on this subject: If it is of paramount importance to one, regardless of reason.... by just increasing the water volume and reactivating the US Cleaner for several minutes....the remaining lecithin will (in almost all cases) go into the emulsified solution. However, bear in mind, you have diluted the entire solution by an equivalent strength-----with NO increase in total vitamin C component.

Please understand, these comments are not meant to browbeat "anyone"....in any way....but, rather, to aid the less technically-informed on the list.

Sincerely, Brooks Bradley.


Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:16 pm
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Owen, I trust you're monitoring this list. I believe Brook's post below is the answer to how he determined 70% efficiency in the homemade Liposomal Vitamin C recipe he developed.

Quote:
Although not scientifically rigorous, I offer a simple test which will yield the DIY researcher some element of confidence that they do, in fact, have a useful measure of liposomal
encapsulate.

First, pour about 4 ounces of your finished Vitamin C encapsulate into a cylindrical, 12 ounce
water glass. Next, place 1/4 teaspoon of sodium bicarbonate into about 1 ounce of distilled water and stir for 3 to 5 seconds.

Next, pour the sodium bicarbonate solution into the Vitamin C mixture and stir gently for several seconds. Note: If the foam/bubble line which forms on top is 1/2 inch or less---in height---you have about a 50% encapsulation efficiency. If the foam/bubble line is 3/8 of one inch...or less, you have about a 60% efficiency.

If the foam/bubble line is 1/8 inch or less, you have about 75% efficiency. If the foam/bubble line is just a trace.....you should major in chemistry.

The percentages given above, represent the amount of the total Vitamin C component incorporated during the encapsulation process.....that was actually encapsulated. The less encapsulation....the greater the foaming.

What is, actually, occurring in this test is that the ascorbic acid fraction is being transformed into the sodium ascorbate form of vitamin C. This test does not negatively affect the usefulness of the solution you have tested.....as the isolated Vitamin C component is not adversely affecting the encapsulate (which is being protected by the lecithin bubble-covering.) Actually, the sodium ascorbate form of vitamin C is greater than an order-of-magnitude more soluble for tissue incorporation......than is the ascorbic acid form.

In any event this simple test should serve to raise the level of confidence in the DIY researcher.... that they do---in fact---have a useful measure of encapsulated vitamin C.

Sincerely, Brooks Bradley.

p.s. I had, a few moments ago, just finished a much more extensive posting.....but some form of invasive advertising spam flashed across the top of my mail system and in attempting to circumvent/nullify the invader I lost my entire post.

The actual post your are receiving is the product of my existing dismay. --


Good Luck & Good Health,

Del


Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:20 am
Vitamin C Master
Vitamin C Master

Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:44 am
Posts: 253
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Thanks for the updates Del,

I guess the most subjective convincing proof for real encapsulation of the ascorbic acid in liposomes is the raising of one's bowel tolerance.. Just did some experimentation with bowel tolerance for two weeks, and presently for me and a single dose of ascorbic acid it lies invariably at around 9 grams (above which one liquid stool follows. My present per day bowel tolerance lies around 45 grams).

So I guess I could assume: if my bowel tolerance for a single dose is raised to 10 grams with self-made liposomal vitamin C, this would mean about 1 gram or about 10% has been encapsulated. A increased tolerance to 13.5 grams would mean 50%, and by tolerating 15 gram almost 70% of the ascorbic acid would have been encapsulated well. Which means a variance from 1 to 6 grams of actual Lypo-C.

The significance of this is that even in the worst case of only 10% encapsulation, 1 single 10 gram dose would already correspond to one packet of Lypo-SphericTM Vitamin C - and in the best case I could avoid the difficulties of an IV C in an emergency, by taking 76 gram daily (170% of my present daily bowel tolerance) and thereby getting the equivalent of 31 gram of liposomal encapsulated vitamin C straight to my cells. This would not only be equal, but superior to 310 gram intravenously! - And in the worst case still 4.5 gram of liposomal encapsulated vitamin C.

On http://www.livonlabs.com/ one can hear:
Dr. Thomas Levy wrote:
... that 5 to 6 gram of liposomal encapsulated Vitamins C is ... much more effective clinically than 50 gram of vitamin C intravenously... Why is this? Well, if you get almost 100% absorption of the liposomal - which we have shown is true - you have 5 grams in the blood. If you take a 50 grams infusion, you've got 50 grams in the blood, 10 fold more. But, I've found the liposome would be clinically superior, in the same way the liposomes get almost a 100% absorption in the blood, the circulating liposomes also get delivery of the vitamin C intracellularly. And of course that's your ultimate bio-target - is inside the cells - that are most effective in your cancer, in your heard disease, being attacked by toxins. It's the idea of bathing in something - versus having it inside you.

That seems convincing enough for me wanting to test it too! - Got an ultrasonic cleaner on Saturday, and am looking for lecithin on Monday. :-)

jaamzg wrote:
I guess I might try to research what is actually the necessary ingredients to make this work.
1) Would it be the frequency of the waves,
2) the power of the source,
3) a certain ratio of phospholipids to aquas solution,
4) etc.

Just to recapitulate (please correct me if I 've got anything wrong):

1) + 2) The frequency and power of the ultrasonic cleaner (UC) seems to make not so much of a difference, and can be adjusted by increasing the duration of the dissolving process in the cleaner. Either a 50 watts, 42,000 cycles, $29.00, or a 160 watts, five preset cycles, $69.99 would work almost as well as a $500.00 lead zirconate titanate, research grade, unit.

3) As a source of phospholipids the dried granular form seems to give better results than liquid soya lecithin. About 3 level tablespoons of lecithin granules should be dissolved into 1 cup of distilled water.

4) The ratio of pure ascorbic acid powder to distilled water should be 1 level tablespoon (12 grams) in 1/2 cup of distilled water dissolved separately.

5) Both solutions are next poured in the UC - better in a separate glass due to concerns of corrosion of the stainless steal container - and slowly stirred while the cleaner is turned on. After about 6 minutes of ultrasonic dissolving the entire solution should be blended into a cloudy, homogeneous, milk-like mixture. Ready for oral use.

6) "The visible, obviously homogenized, portion of the solution" will keep acceptably at room temperature for 3 to 4 days. Refrigerated, it will keep much longer.


Sun Aug 16, 2009 2:12 pm
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Ascorbate Wizard
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Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 3:16 pm
Posts: 9121
Location: Lisle, IL
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Let us know the results of your tolerance experiments (results). Thx

_________________
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:01 am
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Vitamin C Master
Vitamin C Master

Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:44 am
Posts: 253
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
My first attempt:

1) Dissolved 12 grams ascorbic acid in 75 ml of distilled water. Which dissolved fine with quite some stirring.

2) Dissolved 16 grams lecithin granules (with 24% of Phosphatidyl-Choline) in 150 ml of distilled water. Which wouldn't dissolve entirely, though stirred much longer.

3) Poured both into the ultrasonic cleaner (small 50 watts type) and let it run for 8 minutes, while stirring at times.

4) The resulting mixture had still some little granules of a stronger orange color undissolved and a strong acidic taste (which isn't surprising with still 4 to 11 gram of non-encapsulated ascorbic acid). After letting it settle for 1 hour the undissolved granules sank to the bottom and left a viscous murky yellowish/orange mixture for the biggest part above.

5) After drinking the whole, and some rumoring in my bowels (which usually happens at such doses), my next stool remained solid.


I'll continue to tiltrate close to bowel tolerance with ascorbic acid, with the addition of experimenting with once a day the liposomal kind, and different ratios. Titrating for almost 3 weeks now, and not experiencing any perceivable easing as other seem to have - for example of my always clogged nose - makes me curious if it will make a difference this way.

Regards...


Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:47 am
Profile
Post Re: Homemade Lypo C
Ok, I made my first batch of Homemade Liposomal Vitamin C today with mixed results. I used the small 50 watt ($25) Harbor Freight U S cleaner, stirred frequently and cycled the unit 4 times (12 minutes). Following I poured the mixture from the US machine into a large measuring cup. There were quite a few undissolved granules of letchin left in the US.

I than proceeded with the test described above pouring 4 oz. into a 12 oz. straight walled drink glass and adding 1 oz. of water with 1/4 teaspoon bicarbonate of soda and had between a half inch and 3/4's inch of foam on top the test liposomal. I read this to indicate I had less than 50% encapsulation.

Next go at it I will try warming the water slightly prior to mixing and see if that helps at all. For Vitamin C I used Vitamin C Foundation Pharmaceutical Powder and for Letchin I used NOW Brand non-GMO Granules.

Anyone else got any pointers?

Del


Wed Aug 19, 2009 12:06 pm
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