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 Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill 
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Post Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
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Hi I was talking with VCF a few minute regarding the Cardio C product they have, and discussed my past history, he suggested I send some information about myself.

First I started on the Pauling program via buying pills and now have worked my wayy up to the following doses since last Wednesday


Vit C = 12 grams

L-Lysine = 4 grams

L-Proline = 2 grams

Co Q 10 = 1.2 grams

Vit E = 1000 IU



I also take medications as prescribed by my Cardo Guy, who yes is mis lead. However, I had a by pass in July of 1995 and the last Cath showed all the graphs okay, and one small vein that could only be treated for Angina which I just started about 3 weeks ago.

I came in contract with Black Mold and was in a construction location for a restaurant I was doing and unknowing how much damage could occur. I got a viral infection that lead to a water build up in lung two months after the infection ended, and 4 months later had a small heart attack. My refraction rate dropped to 43 per cent and remained there at that level as
of October 2010. I lived in Central American for a while and Oct 2010 hadan arrthmaya; *sp and was revived via Defibrillation. I returned to the USand had a Defibrillator put into my chest and it seems that my heart condition is not going anywhere but down.


My cardo guy said not to help but take pills and more pills, I came across Pauling Theory purchased the supplements and start ed on Wednesday with a buildup of grams to where I am now. VCF suggested that LProline may not work since I had a by pass in 1995 and asked me to consult you. I put my order in for Cardo C and would like to move onto and see how I can improve the quality of my daily living and hopefully get off the mediciations to
some extent or completely. The results to this point have indicated some good feels, more energy and etc. Can you please comment on the process before the order is processed tomorrow.
Thanks

James L.




Sir, if you are willing to list all the pills you have been prescribed, one or more of our experts may comment.

I like the dosages in your current regimen, but yes, we are cautious about the proline soon
after a bypass graph operation because we believe the Lp(a) may help these vein graphs become stronger. (Proline seems to lower the Lp(a) cholesterol) But 1995 should be plenty of time! Our caution usually extends to about a year after the operation. Now your body makes some proline, so our caution may be misg uided.

I think the Cardio-C product is fine, but if you want to be overly cautious, the Tower Labs CardioAde product is only vitamin C and lysine - no proline.

As far as t= he lung infection, I had a similar experience and a positive result from a nebulizer with using hydrogen peroxide. Too soon to recommend.



Quote:
Do you have any idea why B P would shoot up even when medicated with Isosobe Mono, cozar and coreg cr? I woke up at 11:30 pm last night angina was noticeable in the background however BP was 185 over 110 I laid down and made it until the next dose of isosobe Mono? Just wondering.


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Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:43 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
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Sorry but I keep coming up with thoughts and questions since there isn't really a lot of specific data. Well there is about many things I would say, when eating food, does what one eats create or affect the heart with discomfort in the way of an angina flare up? If I fry up some chicken, is the grease going to affect the heart or angina to create discomfort. I am a pretty good watcher of what I eat and being a chef I made many things for myself rather than eating out, buying processed foods etc. However, once in a while I will fix a chicken tender sometimes there are baked much better and occasionally they are fried. When fried I don't eat to much 2 to 3, however, baked tenders are less greasy. I know the body needs some fat daily 30 % so I pretty much keep up with that. I am taking pacerone which conflicts often with thyroid and one gains weight, I am only on 200 mg to help control the heart from fibrillation.


Hope you don't mind the questions, most doctors can't stand it when I speak to them about such things.


James

p.s.

Oh forgot again if Vit C is only in the body or last for 3 to 4 hours is it better to do less each time like instead of taking 4 V C at one time take 2 and then another 2 in three hrs etc? The same would apply with the powder? And what about sleeping time? or is there a gradual residual accumulation of V C in the body to carry one over? I will look over the Forum to see what I can gleam.



Thanks


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Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:45 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
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Okay this is the last one for certain, you probably going to avoid my emails hope not.


To maintain Pauling program, he suggested 6 grams to 18 grams depending on bowl tolerance. Each scoop is 2500 mg so to do the minimum one ought to do 4 scoops and that would last 8 days is that correct? Once I get started on this program I want to maintain what is going to work best for me and that is as much as body can handle, like CoQ 10 I am spreading that out over the day starting today rather than doing 3 caps at one time. Seems like its to much for the heart to handle at one time. Based on 8 scoops per container one would need to buy 4 over the course of the month is that correct? Please verify as I need to look at the cost and see how I am going to pay for this as I am as serious as ever in healing my body and I hope I have that chance to accomplish it. My heart is dialated at about 40 to 43 per cent pumping or at last exam a year ago.


Please excuse my spelling I am not the best for certain


Thanks

James



Good questions. First, it is not coq10 consumed - it is coq10 absorbed. And to be absorbed
you need to take coq10 with fats. (There needs to be bile for CoQ10 to be absorbed)

As we probably mentioned - 5 to 6 g (5000 to 6000 mg) of lysine is maximum, so to reach the extra levels of vitamin C, you should purchase some powdered C and add it to the drink (if you bowel tolerance is that high). In other words, you don't get all the C if your tolerance is high through the PT products, you add vitamin C.

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Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:01 pm
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Ascorbate Wizard
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Could you get a little more specifics from this person??
Since he's taking Cozaar it's a good guess this person is a diabetic which could put a different spin on his BP spikes and angina and VC intake.
He really needs to list his meds from the labels and his conditions he's been diagnoised with.

He lost me on this one also!

Quote:
However, I had a by pass in July of 1995 and the last Cath showed all the graphs okay, and one small vein that could only be treated for Angina which I just started about 3 weeks ago.

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Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:13 pm
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
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I never loved being a pill taker and for 4 plus years I have been attached to them and I surely would like to let them go is possible one of these days…..I am fight weight because of thyroid and the medications take control over this little but very important bugger in my body.

6 am 15 mg of Isosobe Mono for Anagina discomfort less side effects than Ranexa my last doctor wanted me to take max dose of 1 gram

Coreg Cr 80 mg I just started this one about a month and its better than taking coreg 25 mg’s twice a day help for B P

Lasix 20 to keep water flowing out of the body

1 TBLSp Udo’s Omea 3-6-9 Oil



8 am 200 mg of Pacerone to help keep the heart from fibrillating

150 mg of Zantac because the Pacerone upsets the stomach

50 mg of Cozar B P Med

81 mg aspirin

2 Vit D

4 Vit C

1 L-Lysine

1 L-Proline

400 mg of CoQ 10



Lunch

4 Vit C

1L Lysine

1 L Proline

400 Mg CoQ 10



Dinner

4 Vit C

1 L Lysine

1 L Proline

1 400 CoQ 10



Bed Time

1 LLysine

L Proline

1000 IU Vit E

1 Tbl Sp of Udo’s Omega 3-6-9 Oil



That’s it and that’s a lot. My theory is that if I can build up the supplements in the body in time they will do what Linus Pauling suggested would happen cure heart disease and when that moment happens I will be totally grateful for looking on the Internet and seeing this statement “Cure Heart Disease”.

I will start the Powder just as soon as it arrives and go on from there.


James



I hope johnwen will comment on other medications - but zantac is a stomach acid blocker. A big no no - as low stomach acid leads to all sorts of problem including a loss of ability to absorb vitamin C!

Read WHY STOMACH ACID IS GOOD FOR YOU by Jonathan Wright and Lane Lenard.

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Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Wed Oct 19, 2011 3:20 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:
Regarding Zantac, I suppose I could try without taking Zantac if there is no alternative to be used. Didn't know that it was a blocker until your email. Maybe all I have been doing has been lost???


Not lost, maybe diminished. A certain amount of vitamin C (as ascorbic acid) travels through the stomach lining into the blood stream - but only if there is normal stomach acid . Otherwise vitamin C has to travel into gut and has greater opportunity to break down.


A thought.

You had the lung infection? Right? Stomach acid creates a natural barrier to bacteria, keeping all the friendly flora in the gut from migrating up into the lungs. Ever since hospitals started routinely giving these acid blockers, the rates of respiratory infections in hospitals has soared! You want NORMAL stomach acid levels.

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Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:14 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:
Hi Owen


Wanted to share with you one Doctor's view of me taking Zantac for a year plus, "he said, We are treating people who have heart burn and Angina and at times it's difficult to determine which one it is, so the Zantac and others help us to know which one it is heart or heartburn." I hought well, for one year plus I was taking Zantac because I thought it had something to do with the Pacerone and no One gave an explanation and silly me I never asked! That will teach me a good lesson.! Have been without the Zantac for 2 days and all is okay.


James


Unbelievable.

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Wed Oct 26, 2011 3:26 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:
Hi Owen,


Well I got a crushing blow today my hearing has gone down hill and I need to start wearing one in each ear so I don't have to task people to repeat themselves.


I am get close to 5.8 grams and then have been taking 1 gram pill each time I do the liquid drink, so I am doing 10.5 grams and will take one more pill before bed time which will give me 11.5 grams.


Wished it would help the hearing, haha just have to live with it. The tiny little things are expensive.



James


I have seen reports that some 200 medications can cause hearing loss - especially pain meds.

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Fri Oct 28, 2011 2:51 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:
Hi Owen


Well you opened the door for me to do the research and I believe I found the culprit that has caused my loss of hearing, the question is is it permanent?


Tomorrow I will speak to some experts and then my next doctor. The culprit is better known as Lasix or Furosemide and I take 20 mg of it.


I have been taking this since my heart attack September 10 2007. Oh my gosh, I would have never even known until you mentioned it a couple of days ago, I have a call into a auditor association for information.


Is there any legal recourse for this? And with all the Doctors I have had not one of them has ever mentioned it.


Another strike for the doc's, the pharmacy, and those who created it!


Thanks for telling me about this. I would have never seen it until I uncovered a statement on their side effects article.


ciao
James

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Fri Oct 28, 2011 2:52 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:
Hi Owen,


Went to Drugs.com and began reading about the med's I am taking and its scary and then I investigated through some other information about the heart in the sack and what happens when one gets w I have gotten;


Here is the Doctors data, question to follow:


Ventricular Fibrillation
Myocardial Infarction HX of ICD-412
Cardiomyopathy, Ischemic
Hypertension
Hyperlipidemia


Now how all of this got decided is beyond me since they were not the doctors that examined me or did any work other than reading another report from the Doc that did the implantation and he didn't have any information either other than what I had told him.


Question:


Assuming all of this were true which after reading either it is in rest or not true but assuming it was, would it be in my best interest to increase Vit C which I am now at 15.5 grams per day?


Please advise your thoughts


James

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Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:27 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:

Hey Owen,

Something great is happening, just got some of the results from the echocardiogram and the report is better than Doctor expected. Something is working when I get a copy will send onto you to show what's happening...Yeah

James


That is quick! We have noticed that people consistently report a reduction in their angina pain in 10 days, but don't start painting their houses for about 30 days!

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Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath


Mon Oct 31, 2011 6:39 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Wants to reduce heart meds. Suggestions appreciated.

Quote:
Hi Owen,


I am taking the following for BP Control
Isosorbe Mono 30 mg twice daily
Coreg CR 80 mg 0nce per day
Cozaar 50 mg twice per day


My thought would be to reduce Isosorbe to one/half once a day, then the other half a short time after.


Then reduce Cozaar to 50 mg per day and then after a short time nothing

Stay with the Corge Cr 80 mg for a while and monitor B P to see how all is holding up and then remove from Coreg Cr to coreg 25 mg twice daily and then remove one then the other. I could go down to Coreg 12 or 6.25 rather than stopping all together.


Here is the Schedule of Taking V C Before Carido C

10,000 mg per day Vit C from 10/11/11
2,000 mg per day of L-Lsine
1,500 mg per day of L-Proline

Starting on the 22 of Oct to Oct 26

7500 mg of Vit C, 7500mg of L-Lsine and 1500 mg of l_Proline plus 6,000mg of Vit C by pill

Starting Oct 27 up to the Present
10,000 mg of Vit C, 10,000 mg of L-Lsine, 2000 L-Proline plus 8000 mg of Vit c in pill format

Since 0ct 26 I have been taking 1,200 mg of CoQ 10 and only for the last 4 days have I made certain that I am have fat accompany to get as much of each capsule of 400 mg of CoQ 10.

So I have been on Vitamin C 23 days. and that's the skinny on what I have been doing up through lunch today.

I have good equipment to check B P and monitor heart rate, with the Pacemaker keeping things under control so to speak I usually only know if the heart seems like its racing which is seldom, and seems to slow down when I am taking Isosobe, cozaar while the coreg cr a slow release is present as well.


ciao

James
No more information at this moment other than I do well and sometimes I am wondering if I am taking to much..

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Sat Nov 05, 2011 10:41 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Any adjustments made to his prescription Meds should be something his doctor OK's after discussing his reasons with Him/Her. A lot of the drugs he is on have some OFF Label benefits which his doc might be aware of and he is not. Some of the drugs he takes also cannot be stopped COLD and need to be titrated down otherwise serious reactions can result.
My best advice would be to see his doc and make sure he has his attention and lay out to him his plan and let the doc offer his opion and reason for the drugs he's on. Then discuss with him the consquences of not heeding to his advice. Then come to some midground. Which from what I have read will be in the Doc's favor.
Additional advice: Keep a cool open mind and listen. Your talking about your life!!!

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Sat Nov 05, 2011 3:03 pm
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
I agree and told him to read your last post johnwen.

Quote:
So the possibility is that the test result could be bogus without the medication however it would still indicate the heart was dilated, Left Ventricular increased in size and so on, however, if they say normal I need to know what normal is??? Until I discover what that means then I will be in limbo. Thanks for your response.

James

..more about verbal communication from doctor that an echocardiogram (I believe) was "normal"..


Maybe its energy flowing into the heart my heart rate isn't jumping up it just feels maybe full of energy. I guess this is the best I can offer at the moment. Like I said it could be my imagination? Well I just had the experience of what its like to have a natural laxative. For the moment it appears to 10 grm is a good stimulant for my body. Don't need to use a herbal tea stimulant.


Regarding what is normal, it seems to me it is abnormal to have a dilated heart, and showing left Ventricular dilation as well and a lower refraction rate, normal is 50 to 55 % as far as I know.

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Sun Nov 06, 2011 5:51 am
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Post Re: Man with DFIB just starting Pauling Therapy, going downhill
Quote:
Hi Owen

I totally agree with Johwen and I would do that rather than making a decision on my own, not from the responsibility point of view but from sensibility. I never intended to suggest that I would do anything less however, in asking the question previously there must me others who have had similar situations confronting them from Heart disease and through their success with the Pauling program changed or even stopped their med’s. I was wondering when I might have a serious discussion with doctor and say lets look at “now and determine where the heart may or may not be.” From result begin to adjust downward the med’s if warranted with the intention of continued results shown from results of using V C on a daily basis. This all bring to mind that I must have had some serious deficiencies as many do and wondering if 18,000 is sufficient or should I go higher or stay at the level I am at, and based upon past experience of test results etc realizing each of us is different to some extent but we have common thread with the breakdown of collegian, increased cholesterol and eventually shutting down the veins and weakening and dying as a result.


My intention in doing what I am doing is to revitalize my body, help it to have the strength that has been lost do to the deficiencies I have allowed and improve the quality of life. I very willing to go as far as necessary to achieve this not out of fear of dying, but knowing that helping myself to keep life within me alive by feeding it properly and then helping others to see what is possible from youth to aging and for the aging to live a life not having to tie medication to pills that only expand the veins so blood an flow through them. Dispelling the idea that one can make a difference for themselves rather than hearing a Doctor say “I can’t do anything for you other than give you a pill to make it comfortable until death”. Obviously one doesn’t have to accept that statement as final unless they chose to ignore the power they have to help heal the body. One does not have to give up, it I did that, I would be writing this email, I would continue to be dying as the doctor told me not long ago.

And so it may not work in time, I have no idea about that, however, I do know that unless I can make the effort to change and shift from where I was up to reading about Linus Pauling’s work and how it can work for humanity the effort had to begin here. The Vit C isn’t going to jump into my body, nor is my body going to start making it for me, nor is my doctor going to me about what possibilities are for me he is going to withhold that information and possibly I would then die before I ought to pass.

So there you have my thought and the “skinny” of for me. I am excited, I am alive with energy and I am willing to do what I ought to have done to keep the body strong. I thought I was doing that with what I was doing, I sorta didn’t tell the truth to me.



Ciao


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Sun Nov 06, 2011 6:53 am
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