I'll keep chronicling my illness which began in June 2011 http://www.vitamincfoundation.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9194 But it turns out there is a right way and a wrong way to administer the "ultra safe" intravenous vitamin C.
Especially for a person like me with a super high RA (Rheumatoid) Factor.
1. Vitamin C can and will cause a herxheimer reaction at a certain dosage, and "every one knows" you need to follow that up almost immediately with a much smaller "antioxidant" IV dosage (to clean out the debris without generating more toxic garbage.)
2. The effective dosage differs significantly depending whether you are using Cathcart's sodium ascorbate or a commercial (now bioniche) injectible. Most doctors are used to the commercial vials, but they are vastly less effective creating the herx reaction when compared to Cathcart's method of making sodium ascorbate. If you have no experience with Cathcart - you may never experience a herx with vitamin C, (and that may be perfect for drips after dental work, where the intent is to heal and clean up debris.)
I will clean this up and I see about one weeks worth of reading I have missed in other topics.. sigh
Even though I agree with Dr. Levy that all vitamin C really does is donate electrons, and
if you gave 300 g to a healthy person without toxins, there would be no reaction. (I also agree with Thomas Hesselink that very few such "healthy" people exist in today's world.)
So when I say there is a "prooxidant" dosage, it merely means there is a toxin that when vitamin C comes close, causes a reaction leading to an "explosion of debris." Think of the reaction to a high electrical current.
In my case a 100 g commercial (bioniche) fast drip barely caused such a "prooxidant" reaction. (It came so slowly - RA symptoms - I never associated it with the IV/C!)
But a 50 g Cathcart style sodium ascorbate slow drip had a large herx, almost as bad as a 150 g Catchart-style (which removed the use of my arms/fingers and I almost lost the use of my legs.)
So 100 g commercial - no herx, 50 g Cathcart - herx!
This means, if true in general, that when our vials with sodium ascorbate powder hit the market - doctors use to BioNiche/Commerical, will be giving their patients about twice the effective dosage, and if they don't know about this, will begin seeing lots of scary herxheimers. Not sure how to deal with that, but this post is a start.
Today I found that a 25 g Bio Niche IV (I was chicken to use a Cathcart) can be used to mop up, and in my case (high RA) we added a form of cortizone, as I understand it.)
The suggested pre-medication before mop-up or higher-dosed vitamin C infusions is Solu Cortef, 100 mg slow IV push directly before commencing the C infusion. Solu Cortef is a brand-name drug that I used many years ago; I see nothing wrong with using the generic preparation, if that currently exists and is an option for your doc.
Added above because with a high RA factor - this could be key to feeling "normal" Worked like a charm and I want all my IVs with this first!
So next time, I'll find out if a 12.5g Cathcart can perform the same antioxidant/mop up
function. Nervous, but I know that a 50 g Cathcart will otherwise cause a massive herx.
(I always have the prednizone). And Dr. Levy says you can give the smaller slow drip mop up immediately after the large/fast drip (if you have all day.) So you don't have to feel the Herx at all (if you doctor, unlike me, knows what they are doing!)
So comments like this from johnwen,
and another doctor friend of the Foundation wrote me:If you have read Dr. Klenner reports you'll notice he always followed up his initial high dosage infusions with 2-4 Grams V-C IM injections every 4 to 8 hours for a few days after, then to oral dosing after. Now you know why!!
I recommend you taking up to 40g (no more) sodium ascorbate in 500 ml infusion say 10 to 12 hours apart,
You can have a continuous drip but anything above 60 gram sodium ascorbate, one need to add 10 cc calcium gluconate into the subsequent 60 g drip because of risk of hypocalcaemia. This is what you need to remember, anything more than 60g,need to add calcium gluconate, Dr Klenner protocol.
Over the years, I found in my practice, I need to give one 30g and maximum another 30g drip in the evening and for one or two days, 90% patients do well in the febrile patients from what ever cause with oral dose of 2 to 3 grams every 4 to 6 hours or bowel tolerance,etc,
all start to make sense!
Now they tell me!